Welcome to GuppyLog.com
New to Guppylog?
Immediate Help


Conversions and Calculator
Conversions and Tank volume calculator


Add yourself to our guppylog map
Guppylog Members


* Change as much water as often as you can! *
Inkmaker
Front Page · Everything · News · Ask Guppylog · Diaries
Ever heard of this?

All Topics
By RaiderFan92
from the RaiderFan92 department, Section Diaries
Posted on Wed Aug 29, 2007 at 01:27:52 PM PST
Tags: (all tags)
   Im still a rookie in this whole thing, and im 14 with a (Lets face it) small attention span.



   I was browsing on thsi website a couple days ago, (while listening to my brand new "Godsmack" CD!) and I came across the "Filterless tank experiment" entry. I forgot if she said it directly or if it was just a "Heres your sign" sorta thing, but the fact the live plants help the water to balance out, came across to me.
  So I was at Wally-World today and I bought 2 live plant bulbs. Lily-pad plants. Are those going to not be that good in a guppy tank?

P.S. Whos the "Inkmaker"?

< This guy | Need Help >
Menu

· create account

· F.A.Q. For Newbies!

· Immediate Help For Newbies!

· search


Web www.guppylog.com

· Scoop Info

· Our Tanks

Login
Make a new account
Username:
Password:

Related Links
· RaiderFan92's Diary

Display: Sort:
Ever heard of this? | 18 comments (18 topical, editorial, 0 hidden)
Re: Ever heard of this? (none / 0) (#13)
by angelhologram on Tue May 23, 2006 at 05:47:02 AM PST

The poll question is actually kind of hard lol. I'm 30 so when the question is raised as to classic rock are we talking about the stuff that is on VH1 right now (Crue, Guns N Roses, etc) or are we talking more about the Stones, Doors etc? Or could it be the Beatles, The Beach Boys etc.
The same goes for the alternative question. Todays "alternative" isn't the same as it was when I was growing up. I was listening to The Dead Milkmen, Skinnypuppy, Ramones, Bauhouse, The Smiths, Meat Puppet, Butthole Surfers, Melvins, Jane's Addiction, Pixies, Faith No More, R.E.M., Mr. Bungle, Nirvana (they do have more than just the Teen Spirit song!), Primus, Nine Inch Nails, etc.
*BEFORE you buy fish make sure you understand what "Cycling" a tank means <- quoted from miskaral* ~Trying to make a difference one fish at a time~


Re: Ever heard of this? (none / 0) (#14)
by RaiderFan92 on Tue May 23, 2006 at 01:09:45 PM PST

Classical Rock=Led Zeplin, Ozzy, AC\DC

Alt. Rock=Greenday, Fallout Boy

Heavy Metal=Him

HARD ROCK!=Godsmack, Disturbed, Godsmack, Nonpoint, Godsmack

   I sorta like Godsmack.
"The only thing we have to fear, is fear itself."-FDR. True, unless your playing against the Oakland Raiders.
[ Parent ]



Re: Ever heard of this? (none / 0) (#15)
by angelhologram on Tue May 23, 2006 at 04:11:05 PM PST

See what I mean about perception? I would have put Ozzy, Judas Priest, King Diamond under the hard rock title and had Godsmack under heavy metal.
I noticed there was no speed metal, thrash, punk, ska options for bands like Pantera, Cannible Corpse, The Clash, Mighty Mighty Bosstones, Henry Rollins
*BEFORE you buy fish make sure you understand what "Cycling" a tank means <- quoted from miskaral* ~Trying to make a difference one fish at a time~
[ Parent ]


Re: Ever heard of this? (none / 0) (#16)
by RaiderFan92 on Tue May 23, 2006 at 06:33:59 PM PST

   All of that other rock is really just plain specifics, its the sub-class of a sub-class.
   Now Godsmack is worthy of a whole nother rock genre but if they had to fit in one, it would be hard rock because heavy metal is mainly screaming into a mic, with electric and bass guitars squeling and pointless percussion. I hate heavy metal. Hard rock though, has a point, it has a porpuse that the band chose and thought deeply about (except Nonpoint, there just on there own with there music. I have no idea whats up there.) Hard rock has an edge that is very commonly aggressive and loud and intimadating in a way, but as any body that listens to Godsmack knows, it isnt viciouse screaming with no point, Hard rock is actual MUSIC! It expresses something. Wheather its temptation or greed, or sympathy or sorrow.
   Most of Hard Rock is rough, reckless, loud, upbeat, aggresive, but thats what I love about it, the raw noise. Godsmack is my 1# band because of that.

             (Go to iTunes music store or the Windows Medea Guide to listen to free samples if you want to.)

             My favorite Godsmack songs:

5= I am

4=Voodoo

3=Shine Down

2=No Rest For the Wickid

1=Whatever

It is definetly worth it to listen to these.

   Im sorry everyone for Un-guppying this website with my music talk. No more football, rock talk for me on threads, but Ill still do polls of them.

PS I got a black snail for my tank today!
"The only thing we have to fear, is fear itself."-FDR. True, unless your playing against the Oakland Raiders.
[ Parent ]



Re: Ever heard of this? (none / 0) (#17)
by miskairal on Wed May 24, 2006 at 02:00:37 AM PST

Crikey I feel OLD! I don't even know most of them. What about country type rock? There seems to be more music around now that is a little of each of them.

Classic rock also includes Queen, Fleetwood Mac, Pink Floyd, Deep Purple and I would assume ELO.
--
Repeat after me,
I will read the Immediate Help
[ Parent ]



Re: Ever heard of this? (none / 0) (#10)
by ballerina on Mon May 22, 2006 at 06:22:19 PM PST

No one ever answered the p.s. question. I was wondering the same thing - who is the "Inkmaker"?



Please take a look at the last part of (none / 0) (#12)
by unclescott on Tue May 23, 2006 at 02:33:44 AM PST

"While re-reading this section:"  :)

[ Parent ]


Re: Please take a look at the last part of (none / 0) (#18)
by ballerina on Thu Jun 01, 2006 at 05:34:28 PM PST

where is that?

[ Parent ]


Re: Ever heard of this? (none / 0) (#1)
by Alisa on Sun May 21, 2006 at 04:25:43 PM PST

Hi there, I was the one with the filterless tank.  First of all, the gravel in that tank has been around for about 6 months, I am fairly sure that if you tried it with a new tank it wouldn't work at all.
Also, two lilly pad plants are not going to cut it.   You need some proven filtration plants, like say hornwort and javamoss.  I have three mangrove "buds" in my betta tank (also filterless) and they seem to do a pretty good job.  I bought my plants from aquarium garden and the nice thing about them is they usually send you a free plant.  You might want to ask your mom or dad if you can get some for your tank.  If not, you can probubly find some stuff at petco if there is one near you, but the problem with that is they might have snails that could overpopulate your tank.
Also..... ONLY GET TWO FISH I suggest two females, your new tank needs to go through a "cycle" (look at the immediate help) before you attempt this filterless tank thing.  Having only two fish or so will make it easier.
Filterless does not mean you don't have to do any upkeep. I still vacume the gravel every week and top off the water.




Re: Ever heard of this? (none / 0) (#2)
by RaiderFan92 on Sun May 21, 2006 at 06:39:03 PM PST

   Well, I have a tank going now thats been going for about 1 month, so I'm not trying to start a filterless tank, I was just thinking that the plants would HELP the underground filter I have in there now.
   And that experiment you tried was a really neat idea, is the tank as clean as one that has a filter?
   How does a underground clean the tank, I know that it creates a vacuum in the tubes, that suckes the water through the grid on the bottem, but how does that CLEAN it?
   Sorry I have so many questions. Could you answer my poll? Im the only voter so far!
"The only thing we have to fear, is fear itself."-FDR. True, unless your playing against the Oakland Raiders.
[ Parent ]


Re: Ever heard of this? (none / 0) (#3)
by lomelindi on Sun May 21, 2006 at 07:10:19 PM PST

Underground filters do not clean tanks very effectively, now that you mention it.  The idea is that "good-guy" bacteria will build up and grow in the gravel, and when the water is pulled through it, it kinda neutralizes bad stuff.  It also sucks all the fish poo, et cetera, down into it, which just stays there.  Underground filters, if I remember correctly, must be broken down and cleaned every few years.  I'll let someone correct or agree with me on that, as I don't like them much.

However, I would definitely suggest some live plants.  Java fern, Java moss, and hornwort are three that are often suggested for guppy tanks.  They're easy to take care of.  Just remember to remove dead leaves, or the rotting plant matter will just add to the problem.

Incidentally, I doubt you'll get much of a response on your polls.  People here are pretty much tunnel-vision with fish.  Or maybe I'm just speaking for me.

[ Parent ]



Are your bulbs the Aponogeton crispus/ (none / 0) (#4)
by unclescott on Mon May 22, 2006 at 01:25:31 AM PST

an Aponogeton cross or the little water lily, perhaps known as the star lily? There is a also tiger lotus. Lily pad plants sounds like one of the last two. All of those plants are quite attractive. All have been sold as "wonder bulbs."

Lightly bury the bulb partway in the gravel. Push a hole with your finger, never mash the plants in. There will be an obvious growing point you should aim up. Don't bruise it.

Do a little Google image hunting for those names above as the plants grow. If you noticed miskairal's recent note on Aponogetons, she mentions how pretty and useful they are as fry shelters.

They do need a little light, through nowhere as much as some plants. 2 watts per gallon is good. Leaving your lights on 13-14-15-16 hours a day is as important as how strong your light bulb/bulbs are. If the leaves are really spindly, leave the light on a lot longer.

By the way, you don't need to apologize for your age. There have been some wonderful fish raised by 14-year olds. I mentioned that TFH article by a guy your age. As a teacher, I saw all sorts of awesome and clever projects and things done by them. A while back took some freshmen to a constitutional law competition. They gave the upper-classmen a run for their money!

Of course 44-year olds can be inattentive too.  Guppies die for them as well. If you are forgetful about the fish, a little, that is probably ok. If you forget things a lot, take a 3x5 or 5x7 card and make a daily, weekly, monthly "do list". You will have a lot of company in that. :)

All the best!
unc

[ Parent ]



Re: Are your bulbs the Aponogeton crispus/ (none / 0) (#5)
by miskairal on Mon May 22, 2006 at 02:23:27 AM PST

"44-years olds" - are you referring to me? I was only gone a day :)

Polls - the last poll was for you yankees only so I didn't vote :)  I will in this one though.

Didn't I read somewhere that plants don't particularly like undergravel filtes? Mine just don't like me. The one I have left is getting brown spots on it's leaves now despite getting the morning sun as well as that tank's fluoro :(
--
Repeat after me,
I will read the Immediate Help
[ Parent ]



While re-reading this section: (none / 0) (#6)
by unclescott on Mon May 22, 2006 at 09:27:17 AM PST

No M. I wasn't referring to you. I've seen the photo and keep forgetting you're not 25. ;)

RF: One of the things about planted tanks is that they must be thick with plants, almost end to end and side to side. with some swimming room up front. Maybe they will mass by weight 1000 to 1 plants to fish.

That was why lomelindi suggested hornwort. It is fast growing, thrives in hard water and, while it grows a couple of inches a day under strong lighting, will survive with less light. (And as DJ pointed out to an unbelieving unc, can even be anchored in the gravel, despite having no roots.)

By the way, the "Javas" are not real fast growing. The only time I saw fast growing Java moss (climbing out of the tank and commandeering the filter box) was with a 125-gallon set up with some high powered lighting and a CO2 injector. There are a lot of floating and "bunch" plants which are faster growers. They are the plants the pond people call "oxygenators" because they grow and photosynthesize so fast that in the middle of they day the plants are "pearling" or releasing oxygen into the water.

I've offered this link before
http://www.alfanita.com/fishroom_e.htm
but their tanks are just getting into the planted territory where a lot of the waste is taken by plants. They still have filtration and do regular water changes.

That UG (undergravel filter) discussion is worthy of our attention too. I once spent part of a pleasant evening discussing that, at an open house, with Shedd Aquarium aquarist Ralph Bodemer. He was in charge of the legendary "Tropicals Room" which enchanted generations of kids into becoming aquarists. Those were planted (with a combo of plastic and live plants by the way) and had UG filters. Ralph contended that one could grow plants with carefully cleaned UG filters.

However they need to be clean enough that they keep flowing and not go anaerobic. They also must not be so clean that the plants lack nutrients. Ralph had assistants and weekend volunteers and files on when each tank was cleaned. Since there is no way in the world I would ever be able to do all that, I have banished UG filters from my fishroom except for a very rare specialty spawning set-up and maybe raising small fry.

And even Shedd couldn't grow certain plants - hence the plastic ones. And once in a while they had hair algae, which, as much as I dislike it, can be a sign of a healthy aquarium, albeit one with too many plant nutrients in it. ;)

As to the Inkmaker. I'll let you use the Google search function. You will get lots of hits (just for Guppylog) on him. This much of a hint: he is an experienced and innovative aquarist who does use scientific insights to make plan ol' aquarium keeping more fun. If it is working right, it is fun.

Anything thing in life, whether playing some mean guitar riffs or setting up an aquarium so the fish cheerfully spawn, takes some effort and preparation.

All the best!
unc

[ Parent ]



Re: While re-reading this section: (none / 0) (#7)
by RaiderFan92 on Mon May 22, 2006 at 03:10:17 PM PST

   I was reading your 1st reply and you said not to bruise the growing point. Well I fell kinda dumb now because I had gently squezed that part of it to let the air out, so it would stay on the ground ( I was told not to anchor it with gravel ). Will that affect it? I only did that to 1, the other was unharmed.

   Should I quit putting up poll questions about rock and football?
"The only thing we have to fear, is fear itself."-FDR. True, unless your playing against the Oakland Raiders.
[ Parent ]



If the bulb had a little gas and yours was (none / 0) (#8)
by unclescott on Mon May 22, 2006 at 04:58:00 PM PST

a gentle squeeze, that probably didn't hurt. If the gas smelled really awful, it probably didn't matter what you did to the bulb. ;)

Usually they should sink. If they float, next time let them soak a little bit on the surface and see if that does the trick.

I did start some recently in a bare-bottomed tank. Now that they are throwing roots, I need to move them and put them in little depressions in the gravel, which I dug out.

Clever questions on the poll questions, then you get another poll. ;)

I'm sure the music and sports are really important to you, and I have been know to say, go White Sox or Cubs (which means that I'm really into futility) but it is probably better on the whole to emphasize what we have in common, rather than our differences. (I do remember a Rolling Stones' allusion, when we were talking about safe places for guppy fry and someone declared "Gimme Shelter.)

It is neat meeting people, quite different from one's self, who (whom?) we would never otherwise have the privilage of meeting. :)

All the best!
unc

[ Parent ]



Re: If the bulb had a little gas and yours was (none / 0) (#9)
by RaiderFan92 on Mon May 22, 2006 at 06:10:42 PM PST

   Thanks, I'll try to stick to the fish questions rather than my questions based on football or hard-rock. ( Well I will TRY , the 2006 NFL season is comin up, Raiders just got a new quarterback and Defensive back, BOOOOM! )
   And one of my females is getting pretty close to droping I think, it looks like if she got blind-sided she'll just burst into a zillion little fry. Will the rooting lily-pads help with giving the fry protection? I have 4 plastic plants in there now, if the plants dont get big enough by then.
"The only thing we have to fear, is fear itself."-FDR. True, unless your playing against the Oakland Raiders.
[ Parent ]


Re: If the bulb had a little gas and yours was (none / 0) (#11)
by miskairal on Tue May 23, 2006 at 01:15:53 AM PST

Hey I don't mind off topic polls. Actually I think it's a good idea, sort of tells us a little more about our members.
--
Repeat after me,
I will read the Immediate Help
[ Parent ]


Ever heard of this? | 18 comments (18 topical, 0 editorial, 0 hidden)
Display: Sort:

SourceForge Logo Powered by Scoop
Subscribe to our news feed
All trademarks and copyrights on this page are owned by their respective companies. Comments are owned by the Poster. The Rest © 2002 and beyond The Management

create account | faq | search