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How can I control the snails?
By everb from the everb department, Section Ask Guppylog Posted on Wed Aug 29, 2007 at 12:15:33 PM PST Tags: (all tags)

I need to find a way to keep my snails under control...

I keep a 10 gallon multi-purpose tank to grow plants in and for various emergencies (such as my kitten breaking a grow out tank). Some of those plants are ready to be moved to my other tanks but there's a problem. Some pond snails apparently hithed a ride home from the LFS on one of the plants. Fortunately they are currently confined the the mp tank. They'd cause havoc if they managed to infiltrate the 37 gallon tall tank. I just want a sure way to make sure that when I move plants the snails or their eggs don't go along for the ride. However I do keep a small amount of mystery snails in that tank for algae control. So obviously I don't want to poison all the snails in there, just want to be rid of the pond snails. I seem to capture 5-10 of them a day, every day. The tank is full of plants for them to munch on so I don't think baiting them onto lettuce or the like would work. I'm not even particularly concerned about the snails in the tank. I just don't want them migrating to the show tank where they will be nearly impossible to control.

I remember hearing that there were ways to rinse the plants so that it would remove snails and their eggs but wouldn't harm the plant. Does anyone know how to do this? Because I certainly can't risk moving plants to different tanks and having pond snails every where.

Also adding snail eating fish such as loaches or puffers isn't currently an option for various reasons. The puffers nip fins constantly for one thing. But also there are kinds of snails I want in the tanks! Most of my tanks sport atleast a few small gold mystery snails (except for the tank I allow them to breed in which now hosts over 100 of the creatures, and my show tank has a healthy population of malaysian trumpet snails in it that I certainly wish to keep.

And whatever plant rinsing method you guys suggest also needs to kill off the snail eggs. If the eggs can't be removed as well the plant might as well not be rinsed at all for all the good it will do me.

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How can I control the snails? | 11 comments (11 topical, 0 editorial, 0 hidden)

Re: How can I control the snails? (none / 0) (#11)
by awdark on Thu Dec 09, 2004 at 10:17:54 PM PST

Before you kill off your snails, do you think I could possibly buy some from any of you?

My tank has an annoying overgrowth of algae.

my email is
aw[no spam]dark@hotmail.com

Re: How can I control the snails? (none / 0) (#10)
by everb on Mon Nov 29, 2004 at 11:41:25 PM PST

Unfortunately I've had another huge population surge with the pond snails in the MP tank (now the male guppy grow out/plant growing tank). They also managed to hitch their way into a big jar (1 gallon) that I keep a bunch of mystery snails in (tiny ones, about the size of a BB). They must have came along on some java moss I put in there a few weeks ago.

Anyway its now time to resort to more drastic measures. I will be capturing the mystery snails out of the MP tank and returning them to the female grow out tank. Then I will be adding algae killing medecine to the tank. Why? Because first off I don't want an algae bloom in that tank when there arent any snails to keep it in line and secondly the stuff explitly states that it not kill live plants but will kill snails too. We'll see how it works. Time to go bring death to the pond snails before they over run any of my other tanks!
"Man hates those to whom he feels the need to lie."

Re: How can I control the snails? (none / 0) (#2)
by PeterW on Wed Nov 24, 2004 at 12:49:31 PM PST

Its a shame you can't put "yoyo" loaches in there. They're pretty good at wiping out the small snails (and eggs) and will leave the larger ones alone.

And besides, they're seriously amusing fish. They lie down on their sides while sleeping. Or end up upside down. Two of my yoyos hare currently fighting over who gets to sleep wedged in between the ammonia alert and the glass -- upside down!! They stick their tails between the thermometer and the glass and their head ends behind the ammonia alert. I have photos of some of the funnier positions they've ended up in.. I must upload them some day.

How about a quarantine tank with loaches? (none / 0) (#3)
by unclescott on Wed Nov 24, 2004 at 01:29:26 PM PST

You have several aquariums, maybe that would be possible, so that the suggestion is not just a disingenious reason to secure another tank. Of course, there's always that too. :)

All the best!
u.s.

[ Parent ]

Re: How about a quarantine tank with loaches? (none / 0) (#4)
by everb on Wed Nov 24, 2004 at 09:11:23 PM PST

That's actually a really good idea. Wouldn't need a very big tank, maybe a 2.5 gallon or 5 gallon. Then when I'm getting ready to move plants they can go in there for a while so the loach can eat up all the snails that might hitch a ride into my other aquariums. What kind of loach would be best suited for a tank of that size? I had dojo loaches at one point and they were rather entertaining. They look quite a bit like some sort of eel but they don't munch on fish like most eels. They unfortunately died due to some massive pH issues in my show tank that wiped out almost all of the fish. It took quite a bit of effort and time to correct that problem. Perhaps that can be a story for a log entry one day when I get to writing it. Anyway if they eat small snails I'd like to pick up one or two more of those. Do all the loaches munch on snails? Also I wouldn't want to get any sort of aggressive loach because my tanks usually end up serving about 100 purposes at once. Maybe a 5 gallon with the quarantined plants, whatever kind of loach, and a male betta? Also would the loach bother bigger snails? I'd still have the issue of algae control and I generally don't like to add stuff to the aquariums that isnt necessary (such as algaecide). Anyway thanks for the great idea! I'll have to add a small tank to my birthday and christmas list. Lucky for me my birthday is 3 weeks before christmas so its like an appetizer before the main course! And its just far enough apart that no one can get away with combining gifts to cover them both.

Definitely need some help picking out the right loach for the job though. I've never kept any loaches other than those dojos so I really don't know much about them. Thanks again for the idea!
"Man hates those to whom he feels the need to lie."
[ Parent ]

Re: How about a quarantine tank with loaches? (none / 0) (#5)
by PeterW on Sat Nov 27, 2004 at 12:26:12 AM PST

The two loaches that are best known for eating snails are clown and yoyo loaches. I'm sure others do, but those are the two that I've most often heard suggested.

The problem is that they are not suited for small tanks. Clowns will grow up to 30cm (12 inches) and are social fish that really should be kept in groups - 6 or so is what is often recommended.

Yoyos grow to 11cm (4.5 inches) and are also social fish and 3 or more seems to be the recommended number. Some people suggest a single yoyo. (My observations are that they do hang around in groups by choice!)

Anyway, unfortunately that's just not going to be possible for a 2.5 or 5 gallon tank. Having them in an undersized tank (for them) will stunt their growth and that is not something you should plan on because it causes health problems etc. (Just like the plecos that want to grow to 2 feet long!!)

Having these sort of loaches is a long term commitment. They live 15 to 20 years.. That is quite a lot compared to 1-2 years for guppies.

Yoyos sometimes get grumpy and pushy at feeding time, but don't actually seem to hurt other fish. None of my guppies had any problems with them, besides the occasional half-hearted swipe at one of them. All of this stopped when I discovered Hikari sinking algae wafers.. the yoyos go absolutely nuts for them!

I was probably tempting fate, but the yoyos in my community tanks did not seem to be eating guppy fry. I didn't wait long enough to find out the hard way if I was wrong. If anything, the yoyos were helpful in flushing the fry out of the plastic plants so I could net them easier.

[ Parent ]

Re: How about a quarantine tank with loaches? (none / 0) (#6)
by everb on Sat Nov 27, 2004 at 01:40:32 AM PST

Hmmm. I wonder how big those dojo loaches I had get when they are full grown. If they don't get too much bigger than the size the LFS sells them out I think two would fit in a 5 gallon tank without too much of a problem provided that the filtration is adequate and water changes are carried out as in my other tanks. It would have to be a 5 gallon tank or smaller. I'm finally running out of room to place my fish tanks. There is only one more spot available where the rest of my tanks are for a 10 gallon and I would hate to use up the last of my good space on a plant quarantine tank. Adequate spacing for my tanks is quickly becoming a concern these days. I think it may be time to build some sort of rack system for all the tanks somewhere in my room here. Anyway time to go search the internet for the size of the dojo loaches. I already checked to see if they will eat snails and snail eggs but I forgot to even think of how big they get. We'll see how this all turns out soon enough.
"Man hates those to whom he feels the need to lie."
[ Parent ]

Re: How about a quarantine tank with loaches? (none / 0) (#9)
by PeterW on Sun Nov 28, 2004 at 08:42:17 PM PST

Dojo loaches easily get to 5 inches, 8 inches isn't unusual, and 10 inches was the biggest reference that I could find (fishbase.org).

[ Parent ]

Are the dojo loaches the weather loaches (none / 0) (#7)
by unclescott on Sat Nov 27, 2004 at 04:02:58 AM PST

from temperate Europe and Asia? Misgurnus anguillicaudatus, and other species, can grow to a foot or more in exceptional cases. They are also pretty active, so there may be a need for a good oxygen supply.

A very useful source on loaches is
www.loaches.com

http://www.loaches.com/species_pages/wloach.html

has some posts suggesting that they are widely cultured in East Asia as food fishes. They have gotten loose several places and are even found feral in the eastern U.S. (Don't release them or any other aquarium fish though!)

I think it was Scott Lockwood who noted how unpleasant skunk loaches (Botia morleti, formerly Botia horae) could be. I think Botia sidthimunki, the so-called dwarf loach, might be a better candidate. There still are temperature and social factors to consider. And they get bigger, even 5-6 inches, than many of us realize. Maybe three or four of them in a 5.5-gallon tank or a ten? Some plants wouldn't fit into a smaller tank anyway.

I was saddened by the observation that they are rare, anymore, in Thailand, because of over collecting. Maybe not such a good idea on that basis. Bummer! Back to the drawing board and www.loaches.com .

All the best anyway,
u.s.

[ Parent ]

Re: Are the dojo loaches the weather loaches (none / 0) (#8)
by everb on Sat Nov 27, 2004 at 05:02:10 PM PST

Yes the dojo loach and the weather loach are the same creature. Unlike the ones on loaches.com (I was checking on there last night myself) I had a golden variety which were much better looking. Heating and aeration wouldn't be a problem because I keep all of my tanks heated, filtered, and with a running air supply even if they aren't in active use just in case I need to press one into service on short notice. I've ruled out the 2.5 gallon sized tank due to the plant size issue. But a 5 gallon should do just fine. The plants aren't going to be housed in there long term. Just long enough for the snails to be removed by whatever loach or other snail eating fish I happen to come across. The dojo loaches can get pretty big in some instances but they grow rather slowly in my experience. Unlike most of the fish that I pick up from the LFS which generally get a pretty good growth spurt from the higher water quality and food variety that most pet stores don't have the time for. I wouldn't be able to get 5 or 6 of them in a 5 gallon tank but 2 would be ok if I got smaller ones. I can always graduate them up to larger tanks if necessary. Or maybe I should just finally finish resealing my 60 gallon tank. The biggest problem is the lack of space for new aquariums here. I need to be able to the job while using the least amount of space possible. So while I'd like to be using a 10 gallon tank or bigger to quarantine my plants to remove snails, the reality is that I don't have the room for more than a 5 gallon. Does anyone know of another type of fish that would eat snails and snail eggs yet remain small enough to be housed in a 5 gallon aquarium? Dwarf puffers are out of the question due to their tendency to nip fins of any tankmates. This is still a concern for while I don't intend to use the tank for anything other than quarantining new plants, you never know whats going to come up and when I'll need to use the tank for some other problem.
"Man hates those to whom he feels the need to lie."
[ Parent ]

Maybe link onto Cleansing New Plants (none / 0) (#1)
by unclescott on Tue Nov 23, 2004 at 07:17:09 PM PST

via the Guppylog Quicklinks for starters. Potassium Permanganate is a good tank soak. I don't know if it will clear out plants of everthing, but it has been popular with a couple of the better shops I used to know. This can be purchased as Clear Water from Jungle. I have been told that Potassium Permanganate can be purchased in the plumbing/ kitchenware section of some department stores, but I have never found it there. Maybe you have an older place which would carry it.

I tried to order Potassium Permanganate from the Florida Tropical Fish Farms Association's store http://www.4fishstuff.com/
but the guy taking my order noted that Potassium Permanganate (because it is an oxidiser) is considered explosive and can not be shipped on airplanes. Ground shipping, he suggested, was prohibitive. They encouraged cash and carry - in one's own vehicle.

Chelated copper will work but has some intrinsic problems and is hard on some plants. The alum solution as mentioned in that cleansing new plants post should work. The plants really need to be rinsed and rinsed afterwards. These things should work for the pond snails. Not sure if nuclear bombs will work for Malaysian livebearering snails though.

As you know, in principle, snails are not a bad thing in guppy tanks. Of course, too much of a good thing can be a bad thing. Like you, I have found them indispensable in fry tanks.

Perhaps those interested in batting around the topic of snails will find the following Guppylog discussions useful. Several natural controls are suggested.

Invasion of the Snails!
Aquaria
By Hooktor , Section News
Posted on Fri Apr 16th, 2004 at 18:00:12 PST

My tank is being over run!
Frequently Asked Questions
By bytor71
from the all department, Section Ask Guppylog
Posted on Thu Aug 7th, 2003 at 16:49:49 PST

Snails in a fry tank
By maggie1270
from the Maggie1270 department, Section Diaries
Posted on Fri Jan 30th, 2004 at 12:29:17 PST]

Any idea what's wrong?
Guppies
By gupppies, Section Ask Guppylog
Posted on Wed Nov 19th, 2003 at 06:05:57 PST

guppy fries or piglets?
By gupsup007
from the Nate department, Section Diaries
Posted on Wed Feb 4th, 2004 at 15:56:05 PST

Big Gold Snail
Behavior
By miskairal
from the miskairal department, Section Ask Guppylog
Posted on Fri May 7th, 2004 at 17:28:15 PST

A Pretty Good Solution to Pollution
Care Tips
By unclescott Section Ask Guppylog
Posted on Wed Nov 5th, 2003 at 15:52:35 PST

By the way, I was asked by the software to tell whether this was an editorial or topical comment, but given no way to declare it topical.

All the besy anyway,
u.s.

How can I control the snails? | 11 comments (11 topical, 0 editorial, 0 hidden)

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