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Quarantine tank

Care Tips
By red illuzion, Section Ask Guppylog
Posted on Wed Dec 10, 2003 at 11:32:19 AM PST
i have 3 tanks at the moment. a 3 gal tank where i keep trios, a ten gallon where i have my females, and a 39 gal tank where i keep my males, and have a couple of ottos and yoyo's.



i had originally bought my 3 gal tank for hospital/quarantine use. but then decided to keep males and females separate and would only keep the ones i want to mate together. since i want to get some new males i am in need of a new tank or remove my trio from the 3 gal tank. when you use a quantine tank, does it need to be cycled??? i mean, can i have an extra tank, but not have it up and running all the time and only use it for quarantine or medication, or does it need to be running all the time even though i would mostly have no use for it???
< Dropsy anyone??? | three new males!!! >
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Quarantine tank | 27 comments (27 topical, 0 hidden)
can plants (none / 0) (#20)
by parttimer on Fri Dec 12, 2003 at 04:03:20 PM PST

that came from a sick tank and put in a q tank spread the diesease and if yes what is the best way to treat this. i'm talking velvet, ich or any of the many illnesses we talk about here. thanks.  if this was brought up in another topic just let me know and i will continue my search.



Great question, especially because we may tend to (none / 0) (#21)
by unclescott on Fri Dec 12, 2003 at 06:10:02 PM PST

overlook the decore. If the fish are ill and the plants are from the same tank going to the Q-tank, there's nothing new. As is mentioned further down the page, some medicines will zap some plants.

However I would hope that the medication would "clean" up the plants as the fish are getting "cleaned up". And the fish may be less stressed (and stronger) for having plants to shelter in.

* To do this, we may need to look at the specific disease.

Velvet and ich may not be living off of the plants, they are parasitizing the fishes. But I'm sure some free swimming stages of those maladies have been caught by surface tension and moved tank to tank with those plants.

I think that is why one shop i used to know (gone but not forgotten!) used potassium permanganate to combat illnesses on the fish, in the water and on the plants.

That is another reason I'm intrigued by anthemintics such as Flubendazole is that they tend to treat the disease or problem (camallanus, velvet, flukes, hydra, seemingly hexamida) and not kill the plants or even the snails.

However NEVER leave the fish in any treatment way beyond treatment. Was reading where even Melafix can be a problem if left with the fishes for weeks beyond treatment.

May have to experiment with hornwort to see if it survives treatment by anything other than salt. ;)  A hornwort is found in Death Valley in a stream which may get three times as "salty" as the ocean!

That is why if the illness has either infected or at least been exposed to everything in an aquarium, sometimes it makes sense to treat there. The gravel, rocks, filter, heater surface and even the tank sides above the water, the underside of the tank top and maybe even the reflector - if that kind of lighting is there - may have all been touched by the organizms spreading the disease. Nets, feeding equipment (a splashed turkey baster? a dropped for container?), siphon tubes, gravel vacs, water buckets and the aquarist's hands are all possible transporters of those wee beasties.

Some of you guppylog regulars can skip the following, (you've probably heard this message too much) but that is again why the Q-tanks are so important.

In an attempt to make a comparison with computer jargon, we buy anti-virus software to check for viruses in e-mail, attachments, floppy disks and other storage devices. If the discovered virus containing document can not be cleaned up, our software asks us if the offending e-mail (or what ever) should be quarrantined (well what do you know - they may have gotten it from animal & plants husbandry people) or deleted. (That last one courtesy of Dr. Kevorkian.)

Quarrantine tanks are doing much the same hopefully in keeping maladies out by way of one month stays in that way station. That may still not stop internally traveling Hexamita type organisms or Camellanus unless they are given a prophylactic treament. (That is why I have a "largish" order in to Dr. Harrison.)

Sometimes it makes sense to even leave a plant in the bag for a couple of days - the poor boy's quarrantine - to see what drops off or if any hair algae shows itself. At the moment I have some new plants and a new pair of fish in at sort of double quarrentine tank. It is a bit of a mess, but I think it will be for the better. :)

That is also why professional aquariums use a sort of pro-active quarrantine by treating new freshwater fish with a salt water bath and a day or two in a tank with formulin. Marine fish get the freshwater bath. Plants may get the alum soak.

It is not a bad idea to treat the plants. If you know that the medicine will kill them (copper and many plants don't get along) it may be worth a different treatment for the plants (a terrificly strong salt bath for instance). In some cases the plants will just be tossed. (A bonfire has it's virtues.)

Other plants, Java ferns, Crypts, Annubas are so valuable (and tough) that I will try to treat them with the fish.

Oddly, Crypts may actually respond positively to copper when all of the other plants are buying the store.

It may be wise to visit The Krib or the Aquarium Plant Digest archives or to take a google search to see what each species can take and what they can't.

[ Parent ]



In My Opinion, (none / 0) (#1)
by GuppyAdict on Wed Dec 10, 2003 at 06:48:26 PM PST

if you plan on using your tank as a Q tank or hospital tank, I would recommend you still cycle it.  I think that cycling is the most imporant part of this hobby.

When transporting sick fish into your hospital tank, I would want it cycled to reduce any additional stress to your fish.

But with that said, when using a hospital tank, you need to keep in mind that you will end up cleaning out the tank and cycling again each time you are done treating to kill whatever disease was present.  Besides, I'm pretty sure that most of the meds out there will end up killing all your benefical bacteria.  

Someone correct me if I'm wrong.=-)



hmm. (none / 0) (#2)
by red illuzion on Wed Dec 10, 2003 at 07:39:42 PM PST

when you have an emergency, do you have a tank cycled sitting there in case, or do you just move the fish in there and start the mdeication??? so do you also have a tank just sitting there cycled, and when you get new fish you quarantine them in there, or you use one of your presently used tanks and move the fishies out of that tank.

[ Parent ]


Red, this is how I do it (none / 0) (#3)
by GuppyAdict on Wed Dec 10, 2003 at 08:10:41 PM PST

I currently just cycled my q tank and put my guppies in.  I will end up moving them into my cycled 45 gallon community tank in about 3 weeks.  From there I will add 3 more guppies into my Q tank and will continue to do it that way.  

I will always have 2-3 fish in my Qtank to keep the tank cycled.  Remember, if you don't have any fish in your tank and the bacteria is not being fed any ammonia(fish waste, uneaten food), all your beneficial bacteria will eventually die.  I personally would not use the same tank for your Qtank and your hospital tank.  

As for your hospital tank, yeah, I guess you could just keep an empty tank up and running and not have to cycle and then when you need it, you would just put your sick fish in and treat.    


[ Parent ]



thanx GA (none / 0) (#4)
by red illuzion on Wed Dec 10, 2003 at 08:25:50 PM PST

but thats what i didn't want, a tank sitting there cycled with no guppies, lol, guess i won't have a special hospital tank or quarantine tank. i'll just remove my trio's out of the 3 gal when i need a hospital tank or quarantine tank. but after use as i will clean it thoroughly, and then i can place a trio back in it. thanx for your comments.

[ Parent ]


Just remember though, (none / 0) (#5)
by GuppyAdict on Wed Dec 10, 2003 at 09:59:36 PM PST

the more you move around your guppies, the more you will stress them out and cause them to get sick.

Take it from me, you should really invest in at least a 5 gallon Q tank.  It will be worth every penny and it will prevent a major headache for you.

I had an out break of ich in my my 45 g because I didn't quarantine the fish I bought.  And I had to steralize everything and start up again from scratch, and it took me out for 8 weeks.  

[ Parent ]



i understand!!! (none / 0) (#6)
by red illuzion on Thu Dec 11, 2003 at 04:10:25 AM PST

but i really won't be moving them much around, i bought the three males today, and placed them in the 3gal tank. they will stay in there for at least a month, no less. then they go to the male tank. thanx again, i know moving them adds stress but they won't get moved that often, after i'm done with these three i will put a male and a female in the 3gal tank, for maybe a month or so, and a new pair every month, so each fish won't be moved that often.

[ Parent ]


You can set up a q-tank quite quickly with a box (5.00 / 1) (#7)
by unclescott on Thu Dec 11, 2003 at 08:12:27 AM PST

or sponge filter, water and expendible plants (Hygro)from an established tank or tanks. If water is in modest supply, use an under water heater, cut the stem of the sponge filter at 5" (I have a cheap pipe cutter for tubing). Just scale medication to half a ten gallon tank. ;)

Even waiting for fish to get used to new water, I can have one up and going in an hour or two - assuming one is in dry dock.

If there was disease in there the previous month you quarrantined fish, you'd do a tear down and sterilization anyway and have to start over. It may be better to let such a tank air dry away from the fish anyway.

Love the term Q-tank BTW.

[ Parent ]



thanx u.s. (none / 0) (#8)
by red illuzion on Thu Dec 11, 2003 at 04:10:11 PM PST

what's the purpose of the plants in a q-tank?? the purpose of a q-tank is to make sure the new guppies are healthy and disease free right??? if i put them in a tank already established, i don't really need plants do i???

[ Parent ]


Plants? Why did i used to have an old easy chair (none / 0) (#9)
by unclescott on Thu Dec 11, 2003 at 04:48:56 PM PST

in the fishroom. Why does our family pooch drag a cushion under the dining table. (As GG's Rolling Stones would say, "Gimme Shelter.")  ;)

Comfortable, non-threatening environments work as well for fish as people. If you have even been the guest of a medical facility - even the very best of hospitals - as soon as you feel a little better, your living room (however disheveled) is ever so much more comfortable. :)

That was the reason I suggested Najas (guadalupensis?). It is a weed and grows so fast in most livebearer tanks that one can spare some expendable plant material which could be kept in the Q-tank or flushed with the water.

I've used old (non-medicated) Najas for garden mulch. Please never put it in any water system, pond, stream. We have enough exotics around. :)

[ Parent ]



ah!!! (none / 0) (#10)
by red illuzion on Thu Dec 11, 2003 at 05:07:41 PM PST

ok, so its help them feel better, but it has nothing to do with the nitorogen cycle, or anything of the sort, well i only have plants in my male tank, the other two have platic plants, is it necessary to have live ones??? thanx gain u.s., and sorry for so many q's.

[ Parent ]


Red, you are thinking more clearly this morning (none / 0) (#12)
by unclescott on Thu Dec 11, 2003 at 05:20:50 PM PST

than I am. A little help in the ammonia/nitrogen consumption department from plants wouldn't hurt. :)

Plastic plants in a q-tank are probably a great idea. They wouldn't fall apart with medication. (Notice how quickly hornwort falls apart in the presence of medicinal dyes! Even Java moss will sometimes die if in a tank with acriflavin long enough.)

They would offer shelter. They don't fall apart as easily and add to nitrogen problems. They can be treated and or cleansed more easily.

For those of us in the "frugal" school, there's even those soapless plastic pot scrubbers which one can rinse and unravel. When tank cleaning time arrives, shake the fry out of the plastic mesh, wad it up and scrub algae. They can even be tosses in the bleach barrel. ;)

[ Parent ]



ah!!! (none / 0) (#13)
by red illuzion on Thu Dec 11, 2003 at 05:44:56 PM PST

so thats what happens with my hornwort sometimes, it is so nice and green and then this one time it split into a million pieces, but now i know it must of been a medication i used, i'm just glad hornwort grows back very fast, if after a month, there are no visible diseases, is it necessary to clean the tank out, nah, forget it, why risk it, i'll clean it, thanx u.s.

G.A. thanx for your comment too, but the reason why i didn't or don't want live plants is because i don't want to have to have the light on for half the day, electric bill is high as is, don't want to add more to it, not now at least.

[ Parent ]



Hornwort will disintegrate in under 20 minutes in (none / 0) (#22)
by unclescott on Fri Dec 12, 2003 at 06:25:45 PM PST

methylene blue! Never thought to take a stop watch to it! :)

[ Parent ]


I am always willing to trade plants (none / 0) (#14)
by Scott Lockwood on Thu Dec 11, 2003 at 06:12:14 PM PST

for fish. Ship me some interesting fry, and I'll load you up with plants. :-)

"I love to visit PetSmart's Tropical Fish Dept. to see what new diseases are around today." -- inkmaker
[ Parent ]



What kind of fry are you interested in?? (none / 0) (#23)
by Angelee on Mon Dec 15, 2003 at 05:01:26 PM PST

You know Santa already brought me my digital camera for Christmas (I musta been good!) and it has a video camera mode too.  I put some of my pix at imagestation and will continue to do so.  Maybe a video of the fry, huh?  I have several different cobras and not sure what Ceasar is (I posted him).  Let me know, could always use a few extra plants.
Note to self: learn shipping fish 101
Any pointers anyone?
"The Rocky Mountain Gupster" ANGELEE
[ Parent ]


I can help with fish shipping and such (none / 0) (#24)
by Scott Lockwood on Mon Dec 15, 2003 at 07:06:13 PM PST

Where in the world are you at? I'm looking for Green's right now, and green verigated or cobra would be the coolest. :-)

"I love to visit PetSmart's Tropical Fish Dept. to see what new diseases are around today." -- inkmaker
[ Parent ]



Green? Got him! (none / 0) (#25)
by Angelee on Tue Dec 16, 2003 at 10:13:36 PM PST

I'm in the Denver metro area, Colorado.  Julius (I'll get better pictures of him online), I believe he is a green cobra. The pic up doesn't do him justice, he doesn't like to have his picture taken (go figure huh?). I also have a female who looks suspiciously like a cobra of some sort. Lady is her name.  I'll try and get pix of all my cobras up by the end of the week.
"The Rocky Mountain Gupster" ANGELEE
[ Parent ]


If you have some fry from this pairing... (none / 0) (#26)
by Scott Lockwood on Tue Dec 16, 2003 at 10:19:50 PM PST

I'd be really happy to swap plants for fish. :-)

"I love to visit PetSmart's Tropical Fish Dept. to see what new diseases are around today." -- inkmaker
[ Parent ]



K. Lady had her first batch Dec 6... (none / 0) (#27)
by Angelee on Thu Dec 18, 2003 at 04:11:25 PM PST

I'm not sure what I'm going to get from the first batch, so I'll pair em up and see what happens.  (This way I'll be confident it was these two)  I think she's still "pregnant" though.  Thankfully, she's pretty picky and likes the big Cobras and Ceasar pretty exclusively.  She gets testy with the other males.  I'll give an update when it happens.
"The Rocky Mountain Gupster" ANGELEE
[ Parent ]


Whatcha got in plants for trade? (none / 0) (#15)
by unclescott on Thu Dec 11, 2003 at 06:49:35 PM PST

I could trade some a cloud of small Endler's, some Limia melanogaster, odd platys, reject swordtails and a cool Rivulus cylindraceus.

Ha! The green cobra guppies are getting fat, but haven't dropped to my knowledge yet! Maybe crank the room's heat up.

[ Parent ]



Ooooh - Green you say? (none / 0) (#16)
by Scott Lockwood on Thu Dec 11, 2003 at 07:23:40 PM PST

I have the same plants as last time pretty much, I do have this one new plant. You should come over! The plants are getting so overgrown, I may end up having to either dispose of some soon, or get another tank just to keep them in! :-)

"I love to visit PetSmart's Tropical Fish Dept. to see what new diseases are around today." -- inkmaker
[ Parent ]



Go with plan B. (none / 0) (#17)
by unclescott on Thu Dec 11, 2003 at 07:25:59 PM PST

I will not tell Reza! ;)

[ Parent ]


Heh. I'd have to tell her. (none / 0) (#18)
by Scott Lockwood on Thu Dec 11, 2003 at 07:39:26 PM PST

I need more electricity to sucessfully setup anymore tanks!

"I love to visit PetSmart's Tropical Fish Dept. to see what new diseases are around today." -- inkmaker
[ Parent ]



Tell her? (none / 0) (#19)
by Reza on Thu Dec 11, 2003 at 09:18:39 PM PST

<<GIGGLE>>

It's a good thing that she reads Guppylog to see what's going on.

:-)

[ Parent ]



A lot of plants help (none / 0) (#11)
by GuppyAdict on Thu Dec 11, 2003 at 05:20:12 PM PST

with absorbing some of the excess ammonia from your tanks.  So having live plants is always a good thing, but not necessary for the nitrogen cycle.  

Like UncleScott mentioned, plants also help to establish a natural environment for them and that makes them feel more at home.  

[ Parent ]



Quarantine tank | 27 comments (27 topical, 0 hidden)
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