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female availability

Etc.
By finatic, Section Ask Guppylog
Posted on Wed Aug 29, 2007 at 12:25:12 PM PST
Tags: (all tags)
Hi everyone,

Why is it so hard to find good quality female guppies in pet stores?



I live in the Toronto area and we are serviced by a well established chain called Big Al's.  I've been to a few of their locations, as well as other pet stores, and I find that generally the selection of female guppies is nil.  They are all lumped into one tank, looking pretty drab.  Why don't they have females available that correspond to the different varieties of males being offerred?  Is that pretty much standard in other locations besides Toronto?  

I know that the appearance of the females don't reflect their genes that well, but the females I've come across are pretty plain.  

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female availability | 15 comments (15 topical, editorial, 0 hidden)
Well I am now chockablock (none / 0) (#11)
by cloe on Tue Nov 18, 2003 at 02:04:15 PM PST

of great new guppies from my first guppy meeting I went to. The auction they had (every month) really allowed me to pick a new type of guppy I never had before (japan blue) so I am really excited! And they did have females just for auction too - Cloe



drab female problem (none / 0) (#10)
by Angelee on Thu Nov 13, 2003 at 04:48:07 PM PST

Hi.  I live in Arvada, Colorado.  I haven't had a problem finding decent females here.  It may be a regional thing.  You may try to visit some of the Mom and Pop pet stores or order online if you still can't find any.  I have been pretty lucky in that department.  I have a purple dragon female that is beautiful (almost entirely white, with black spots on the tail). I purchased her with a matching male at Petsmart.  I also bought a similar colored purple dragon female that looks suspiciously crossed with an electric blue.  Her spots on the tail are blue and white.  I have a tequila sunrise female, yellow body with an interesting red eye on her tail (mom and pop store).  You really have to look around if you want attractive females.  The stored I went into were surprised that I just wanted attractive females, instead of males. (Typical at the larger chains.)  Another female I have is blackwith yellow spots on her tail.  They really do come in a nice variety. (I promise)  
"The Rocky Mountain Gupster" ANGELEE


Hi finatic! (none / 0) (#2)
by unclescott on Mon Nov 03, 2003 at 10:14:43 PM PST

I see several possible reasons why we don't see as many great female guppies as great males in some (not all) shops. A non-inclusive gripe list would include:

1. "They" don't want hobbyists breeding them. If you think finding female guppies is tough, try finding a female dwarf gourami in many parts of the US..! :(

2. Some shops get pressed for space and mix females and males, of different strains, together because they are limited number of tanks. I would guess most businesses have a sales per square feet of floor space goal.

3. Some shops just get sloppy and mix them. Maybe their owners are very savey in terms of some business methods, but they may not be "fish people" and just don't know any better.

4. It's a "big box store". If they don't have a genuine aquarist in charge of their aquarium department to oversee and retrain the revolving door of employees. One big box employee I know shared his surprise over how many people in their particular place came from grocery stores. An honorable line of work, but maybe not immersed in aquarium care. Every now and then though one hears refreshing stories of managers who do care and do know what to do when marketing their stock.

5. Some owners are bluntly realistic business people who realize that 95+ %  of their customers just want some pretty fish swimming around in a colorful, animated, community tank. Females are a financial burden taking up tank space in a narrow margin business. (I fear they are short sighted.)

6 There aren't so many of the old "Ma & Pa" pet shops. When the big boxes move into a state usually 1/3 to 2/3s of the little shops will fold.

The more sophisticated of the "Ma & Pa" operations would often (and still do) trade store credit for locally raised fish. They were smart enough to understand how much heartier guppies and other fish would be if raised in local waters and not traumatized by shipping across the globe.

Females of a strain, by the way, do usually reflect the colors of the males. The better shops are wise enought to leave the appropriate males and females together. The courting and chasing makes those fish just that much more robust, active and desirable. With a light planting, those tanks can become shrines. ;)

For a couple of examples take a look at the female with the AOC BICOLOR & BLUE/GREEN BICOLOR COBRAS
http://members.tripod.com/~ppga/lukesales2b.html
or the male and female blacks at
http://members.tripod.com/~ppga/lukesales2.html

A number of those shop owners, time permitting,  are good instructors in the craft. The really good ones are also willing to learn from the customers. (I had a 15% off book deal with a guy if I would let him skim the books - sometimes too specialized to economically stock on the shop's shelves - when they came in).

If the truth was known about many of the small outfits, too many of them have been only marginally profitable for a long time. About three decades ago a guy with one of the Chicago area wholesalers mentioned that a third of the local shops were in danger of declaring bankrupsy. He complained that too many shop keepers were either hobbyists without enough business training or merchants without enough of a feel for the animals and their customers.

In the '80s I helped the widow of one of Chicago's legendary shop keepers go over some of his stuff. (This is being typed on top of his old lab table.) Having seen his books, one could assume that if he wasn't supported by some investments and a modest pension, I don't know how they would have kept their place open. They were generous to a fault (kids liked to ask George for a dozen feeder guppies because they knew that a dozen was 16 or 18.) The most famous canary keeping (her)/ fish article writing (him) couple in an area of 7,000,000 essentially ran their place as a hobby and fish nut social center.

7. In one case there was a guppy guy in a far away corner of our metropolitan region who seemed just plain uncooperative. He bred for competition. So edgy was he, according to my informant, about letting others take his guppy culls and compete against him that he would never give or sell any of his guppies to another person and he destroyed his extras rather than give them/ sell them to shops.

Actually he sounds like a sad and lonely person.

What a tragic waste of talent and effort!

Wow! It must be Monday, cloudy, gloomy, increasingly cold, rainy and pessimistic! ;)

The good news is that there are still a lot of general clubs and several good guppy clubs with skilled guppy people willing to share their knowledge and fish with others.

There still are shops to be treasured. Carloads of fish nuts will set up Saturday drives to get to and from their favorite shops. (Michiana Aquarium Society rents a bus and runs a tour tjrough Northern Indiana to Chicago to Milwaukee and back.)

There are probably more guppy books and publications for sale than ever before.

There are guppies available which can really show up the best that the hobby had to offer a few decades ago.

If one cruises the Net they will find a number of site such as this with people willing to palaver and share.

Maybe a column or sidebar could be affixed in this site listing guppy and guppy related events in the U.S. and around the world. That way denizons of Guppylog could sometimes get to such an event (bring checkbook, fishbox, flashlight, estra bags and make sure there are empty, seasoned tanks at home). Or.... sometimes a fish friend can do some proxy bidding on one's behalf. (I had a buddy at a show this last weekend, blank signed check in hand. He may have done me a favor by having to leave early .)

I'm sorry if this response sounds too grumpy. There are a lot of terrific fish heads out there. I'm honored to call some of them friends.

Got a very gracious note from a livebearer enthusiast this morning offering a pair of fish which couldn't have been purchased at Kalamazoo without a small mortgage. "just show up at the meeting Friday." ;)

Aquatic specialties which take competition too seriously or offer a chance to make a little to a lot of money off of the fish raised encourage people to try harder to produce better fish.

Sometimes though we, just like the shops, take the competition and hope for financial remuneration a tad too seriously. It may be a passion, but it for us it is a hobby. :)



Hey (none / 0) (#6)
by cloe on Thu Nov 06, 2003 at 07:46:58 PM PST

Im just happy to bring my couple month old fry into the lfs and get free food! I still think I am very far away from competeting - one little ribbon would be nice - I also know that local clubs often exchange stock without worry but as a way to increase the hobby!
And I like the word "palaver" good useage!
Cloe

[ Parent ]


You've done it now!!! (none / 0) (#7)
by guppygirl on Sat Nov 08, 2003 at 03:20:23 AM PST

Cloe, don't get him started on that track again.

He loves to use words that make you grab for your dictionary, and then he pulls a "gotcha" and makes a few up.

Well, what's done is done, hope you have a good dictionary, and thesaurus at the ready!!!
;-)

[ Parent ]



Palaver, that is what (none / 0) (#8)
by unclescott on Sat Nov 08, 2003 at 05:13:53 PM PST

pals do, ;)

[ Parent ]


Hmmm palaver (none / 0) (#13)
by Angelee on Fri Nov 21, 2003 at 04:56:26 PM PST

     I like your particular articulation.  
"The Rocky Mountain Gupster" ANGELEE
[ Parent ]


What pals do... (none / 0) (#9)
by guppygirl on Sun Nov 09, 2003 at 12:24:56 PM PST

I know, I know, I looked it up!!!

Your pal,
gg

:-)

[ Parent ]



thnx guys! (none / 0) (#3)
by finatic on Tue Nov 04, 2003 at 08:14:04 AM PST

thnx for the responses.  I really appreciate your thorough and thoughtful answers.  It really is frustrating when reputable establishments sometime fall short of expectations.  But I guess compromises need to tilt in favor of business smarts over other interests in most cases.  *sigh*

Whenever I visit any fish stores I make a beeline for the guppies and look first for quality females.  Big Al's is big, HUGE.  They can have 8-10 tanks of different varieties of males (beautiful ones) and one pitiful tank of different females.  

Anyhow, as I just reentered the hobby now I have to make do with the very best of the very, very, very worst selection of females.  Not just at Big Al's, but any pet store I've visited thus far in Toronto. As my first time frys are beginning to color, they're looking more like a smorgasboard of multicolored mules.  At first the thought of purchasing trios from breeders at $50 US (which converts into a fortune in Canadian!) seemed way far fetched, it's turning out to make more sense.  


[ Parent ]



Before you upset Canada's trade balance ;) (none / 0) (#5)
by unclescott on Tue Nov 04, 2003 at 05:18:14 PM PST

(although the U.S. trade balance sure needs help) check out aquarium groups in your area. Just asking around will give you ideas and contacts.

A quick yahoo search for aquarium clubs Canada (page one of a whole lot) gave me the following. Feel free to link from there. I'm sure you can yahoo and google all day or evening. ;)

I'm not aware of all of the communities in the greater Toronto area. Perhaps you will find other groups actually closer to where you reside. Knowing nothing of Toronto area aquarium groups so I'm not trying to specifically criticize anyone, sometimes the group one becomes most comfortable with is not the closest either.

http://faq.thekrib.com/organizations.html  bottom of the page

http://www.netpets.com/fish/fishclub/international/canadasoc.html

Canadian Association of Aquarium Clubs
Contact Mrs. Sarah Langthorne, 95 East 31st St, Hamilton Ontario, Canada L8V 3N9. President David Boehm, fishman@golden.net, phone 519-746-6316.

(from the fins list)
http://fins.actwin.com/dir/clubs-national.php

http://northeastcouncil.org/html/
This is a U.S. group of groups, they have some contacts and events only 2 zillion miles from Toronto though.

Toronto A.S.
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/TASociety/

gee, a chat site, among other things. ;)

The nearest IFGA groups are in Detroit & New England. If you really want to get into show guppies, check out their events and 2004 calendar. See
 http://www.ifga.org/_mainframe.htm

Don't go away from Guppylog, Finatic. But these or links from them might give you a start as you get back in the hobby. "EH?"

(So many neat fish people, so little time.)

[ Parent ]



Blah females. (none / 0) (#4)
by guppygirl on Tue Nov 04, 2003 at 10:55:12 AM PST

Well, EXCEPT for the human species, in the animal kingdom males are almost always more attractive
than females.

Many birds, like peacocks, etc. Then there are the lions and deer, and the like.

Actually, I kind of LIKE blah females, although their appearance genes may be hidden, that just adds to the suspense of what the fry will look like for me.

I don't know, maybe I'm weird, but I love that odd ball guppy look.
My latest is purple body, with bright orange tail, and long white, or orange dorsal.

I'm on the third litter of these, I think, time will tell.
Mother had a little white on tail and dorsal, but otherwise, blah, blah, blah.

I think that's the fun of the mystery of the guppy.

It's like the Lottery commercials, "Hey, you never know."
:-)

[ Parent ]



UH HUH! Another one! (none / 0) (#12)
by Angelee on Fri Nov 21, 2003 at 04:37:56 PM PST

   Thank goodness, someone else is also the bane of the fish stores!  It's kind of funny, I walk in to the local pet stores and the people at the podiums suddenly go on break,.. it never fails.  A tank stock full up of fish, and here I am..."Yeah see that ONE fish right there,  the originally colored one... no not THAT one...nope that's not it either..." One woman actually told me that she couldn't catch one particular fish in a tank full of fish.  IMAGINE!!  I told her to give me the net.. I have one that's white and light blue with orange spots.  Including a large orange eye on its side.  Unique. Out of curiousity, does anyone else name their fish...ever??  My daughter took one look at the orange and blue and named him....you guessed it  "Bronco".  Try explaining THAT to your spouse.(Honey, she's naming the fish again.)   We have an african dwarf frog named  "Froggy Doodle"..the list goes on and on.  I wondered if we were the only ones.
See ya
Angelee
"The Rocky Mountain Gupster" ANGELEE
[ Parent ]


yep!!!! i name the lil guys too (none / 0) (#14)
by neothefishie on Tue Nov 25, 2003 at 05:18:25 AM PST

lol i actually have named almost all my fishies. once i can tell them apart from the others, they get a name. it brings out the kid in you to sit and name 40 fish at once :)
-neo the fishie-
[ Parent ]


Guilty as well... (none / 0) (#15)
by guppygirl on Wed Dec 03, 2003 at 03:28:20 AM PST

But I don't name them all.
Just the one's that need names, "Fertile Myrtle",
"Aunt Stell", "Little Lulu", and "Travolta".
;-)

[ Parent ]


I heard of Big Al's (none / 0) (#1)
by GuppyAdict on Mon Nov 03, 2003 at 10:10:58 PM PST

I thought it was more fish supplies that they specialize in.  

The LFS in California actually separate the females and males.  As for color though, yeah, the females are pretty boring but are very healthy looking.

I noticed that all of them seemed to be pregnant already too.  I guess they don't separate them fast enough.  



female availability | 15 comments (15 topical, 0 editorial, 0 hidden)
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