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salt water tanks.... | 7 comments (7 topical, editorial, 0 hidden)

Re: salt water tanks.... (none / 0) (#2)
by miskairal on Wed Jan 11, 2006 at 02:40:31 PM PST

Hi wraith

As da unc says, seahorses should not be kept with other fish except maybe a mandarin. Both are for experienced marine keepers only.

I have had a lot of trouble finding sites that I understand. There is either too much detail (scientific gobbledegook) or too many contradictions.

Here's what I've learnt after starting up a 700 litre tank in October.

Read, read, read and read more (dont' expect to understand it all though).

Find a good marine petshop.

Plan a quarantine tank as the stock you buy is way too expensive and precious to risk losses.

Don't expect it to all go right and your tank will probably look quite ugly at first with hair algae, diatoms etc.

Research (I wll give you some links later) and then ask questions here - rec.aquaria.marine.reefs as you get the best answers here. It is a newsgroup so if you dont' know how to access a newsgroup there is a mirror forum somewhere which I can find a link to for you.

Go slooooooow! Don't rush anything.

Have a huge bank account - several thousand would be a good start.

Budget for salt for water changes.

Buy heaps of test kits. (Phosphates, Calcium, KH, Ammonia, Nitrites, Nitrates, pH and more)

No, it is not just as easy as freshwater even once you have it set up but it is far more fascinating.

Many recommend cheap damsels as starter fish. Don't do it. They are aggressive and you shouldn't be adding any fish if your tank hasn't cycled anyway. I went with tank bred ocellaris clowns and they are fine.

I'll write more later - I have to go now.
--
Repeat after me,
I will read the Immediate Help

Re: salt water tanks.... (none / 0) (#3)
by miskairal on Thu Jan 12, 2006 at 01:03:35 AM PST

Back again.

I've got together a few links that I find the best. There is way more stuff out there but I think you will find these the easiest.

Aquahobby has good but limited info. Great starting place to get the gist of things. If you click on the links you will find simple info on how they should be kept and you will also find comments from those that have kept them.
http://www.aquahobby.com/e_marine.php

At the same site you will find marine articles in the lower half of this page
http://www.aquahobby.com/e_articles.php
with this one about species NOT for beginners being particularly good
http://www.aquahobby.com/articles/e_marine_fish.php

There is also a saltwater section in amongst the forums (the link says board)
http://www.aquahobby.com/board/index.php

I've found most of the stuff around is in the form of forums or Q. and A. which is tough going to read through it all. This forum is fairly easy on the brain though
http://www.aquatic-hobbyist.com/phpBB2/viewforum.php?f=12&sid=89a0deb66eef9569772df16c62f4e7b9

This next link is not to a forum but one of the few places I've found that has info without you
having to guess which forum link to read. It is not a dialup friendly site though.
http://www.melevsreef.com/

This one has forums but also has the "Resource Library" which is good.
http://www.reeffrontiers.com/

This one got me because it makes available the rec.aquaria.marine.reefs newsgroup, I mentioned in my last comment, in a web forum interface.
http://www.fishkeepingbanter.com/
If you go to this link and click on the reefs link you will find all the stuff from the newsgroup.
This might not give you so much info but it's a good place to ask questions.

I guarantee you will get conflicting info on everything from whether or not to use seawater or
make up your own salt water to what the specific gravity of your water should be, whether or not to use a sump/refugium, what sort of lighting is required (corals need way better lighting than plants).

I spent 6 months thinking and reading before I actually put water in my tank. Probably overkill but I was pretty nervous about spending so much money. Mind you, my tank is big, very big. Here's a hint just from me actually - try to get a tank that you can reach the bottom. I can't reach the bottom of mine which makes it extremely difficult to set up the live rock and to place corals.

If you want corals as well you will have to take into consideration how warm your tank will get in summer. If you have air con all is well and good. If you have to buy a chiller to keep the tank below about 29°c and preferably a bit lower, then you are looking at another $1000 here in Oz. Corals and starfish die in temps higher than that especially if for more than a day or two.

Get the best quality live rock you can afford as this is your filtering system of the future. Mine came from Cairns and seems to be excellent.

Here are some links to my own tank critters.
This one was to show distant family my fish that I have so far
http://goatdairying.com//fish/marine/december2005.html

This page I made so I could ask the folk at rec.aquaria.marine.reefs what the first stuff I found in the tank was
http://goatdairying.com/fish/marine/marineunknown.html

And this one I made up yesterday to ask them more
http://goatdairying.com/fish/marine/live_rock_stuff/liverockstuff.html

Hey look at that, I've written nearly as much as unc does ;)
Let me know how you go as I'd be very interested.

Cheerio
miskairal
--
Repeat after me,
I will read the Immediate Help
[ Parent ]

Re: salt water tanks.... (none / 0) (#5)
by wraith on Thu Jan 12, 2006 at 09:52:17 AM PST

thanks so much for the info and web sites. After looking through a few of them, it didn't take much to convince me that seahorses would not be in the plan. As interesting and beautiful as I has always thought them to be, they seem to be very hard to care for. I think as a beginner I will be looking at some simple fish. I am expecting this whole process to take me about 6 months as well. I have to build the stand, as I want something particular. And then I will get the tank and accessories a little at a time. In the meantime you have both given me some great places to begin reading, thank you.
miskairal your tank looks great! You have some beautiful fish! And the live rock, it must be so neat to watch it change and grow! I am not aiming for a tank as large as yours, I was thinking more like 50-70G, we'll see how much the stand will hold. Good point about being able to reach the bottom though!
Have a great day!

Cheers!

[ Parent ]

"We'll see how much the stand (none / 0) (#7)
by unclescott on Thu Jan 12, 2006 at 07:36:22 PM PST

will hold..."

This isn't for you as much as for some someone looking on, but also look to see what the floor will hold. Water, at almost 9 pounds per gallon, is just the start. There is also the stand. Gravel, decorations and accessories are denser than the water and add more weight. (This is the one time I'm glad we have a slab foundation and We still tend to put tanks close to the wall.)

You also don't want it where drafts, really warm air or the sunshine will hit it sometime during the day. Not such a big deal with one tank as in the fishroom, but if it is not easily accessible, it will not get as much care as if it were very accessible.

Something much trickier with marine talks is leaks and splashes. "Salt Creep" just kills furniture and floors. You can imagine what else doesn't need salt water on it.

Any big tanks need more care in leveling them. The stand can be "shimmed" with little pieces of carpet samples matching yours. If you would prefer to shim on top of the stand, cut cardboard and add about twice what you think you need, to compensate for compression. A small carpenter's balance (or a large one borrowed from the handy person on the block) is essential. This all helps guard against "Salt boom".

There is a TFH (Tropical Fish Hobbyist Magazine) column called The Salt Creep. I enjoy the humor and attitude of someone who doesn't mind the double entendre.

If you have very hard tap water, you may want to investigate a R.O. unit. A common problem is the presence of micro algae, especially encouraged by minerals in the tap water. By mixing the marine mix with largely demineralized water, one can limit the phosphorus in the water and hence the unwanted algae. The retail price of R.O. units has really come down in the 19 years since I bought one. That probably is because so many more are being purchased. The bulk of those purchases are by health or cuisine conscious families and restaurants and even bottling companies, virtually all of whom remake their water. Another factor in the growing R.O. market is probably the dramatic growth in the number of marine aquarists. One can also arrange, sometimes with the flick of a switch, to save water for the family's cooking and house-plants.

Just grist for the mill!

All the best!

uncle I haven't got as much to say as Miskairal but that doesn't mean I'll shut up :) Scott

[ Parent ]

Re: salt water tanks.... (none / 0) (#6)
by miskairal on Thu Jan 12, 2006 at 01:24:05 PM PST

Planning so far ahead as you are means you will probably do well.

Try for the 70 (264 Litre) tank rather than the smaller. It's the same as for freshwater, the bigger the tank the more time you have to find and correct problems. I still haven't worked out how you know how many fish you can have with saltwater. I read once that it's about an inch per 5 gallons (a centimetre per 7.5 litres). You will probably find though that you don't really want all that many fish because there are plenty of other things to look at.

I bought my tank second hand for freshwater fish but a friend saw it and said one word - "Marine" and the seed was planted. It really is too big but I have plenty of room in this 97 year old house.
--
Repeat after me,
I will read the Immediate Help
[ Parent ]

salt water tanks.... | 7 comments (7 topical, 0 editorial, 0 hidden)

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