Welcome to GuppyLog.com
New to Guppylog?
Immediate Help


Conversions and Calculator
Conversions and Tank volume calculator


Add yourself to our guppylog map
Guppylog Members


* Change as much water as often as you can! *
Inkmaker
Front Page · Everything · News · Ask Guppylog · Diaries
Display: Sort:
AARGH!!! !@#^%!@$# Camallanus! | 18 comments (18 topical, 0 editorial, 0 hidden)
Re: AARGH!!! !@#^%!@$# Camallanus! (none / 0) (#12)
by PeterW on Thu Feb 10, 2005 at 04:36:11 PM PST

Wow.  Patient Zero just did the mother-of-all-poops.  Two inches long, roughly 1.5mm in diameter (I'm guessing that is about 1/16 of an inch) made up of all sorts of "things".  Pretty gross actually.

What is really freaky is that a "pod" or cyst type thing was included in the strand including all sorts of things inside.  I could almost imagine that being a nest or cluster of worms or something.  And the last part out was the normal colour.

Oh boy, if she had all that clogged up inside...  Poor fishy!

The bad news is that I've found the worms in at least one more tank, and I dont know for sure which it was.  They were in the bottom of a bucket that I used to siphon water out of three tanks with.  I have an idea which one it came from, but I was planning to treat all of those anyway - I was reducing the water levels to reduce the amount of levamisole I needed.

Interestingly,  by looking at the fish behavior, I can see that some of them are acting "strange" for guppies - ie: rather quiet.  While other tanks are running at 100% maximum capacity mating activity - definately not "quiet". So far all the worms have come from (I think) the quiet ones.

I dont think all the tanks are infected.  At least not to the same level as the worst ones.



Re: AARGH!!! !@#^%!@$# Camallanus! (none / 0) (#14)
by miskairal on Thu Feb 10, 2005 at 07:52:08 PM PST

"Better out than in" as the saying goes. I wonder if that means she is no longer infected?
--
Repeat after me,
I will read the Immediate Help
[ Parent ]


Were you able to siphon that out ASAP? (none / 1) (#13)
by unclescott on Thu Feb 10, 2005 at 07:22:01 PM PST

Would you have been able to put it under a microscope? Do you have a video connection you could make to that microscope? (I would be yes, maybe, no so would not wish to be judgemental.) Camallanus are livebearers, but evidentally eggs cases for other worms and wee beasties can be identified from faeces. Or so I've read. ;)

So long as you are finding stuff in the bucket and it is an out bucket, nothing is worse. I imagine you do this Peter, but for the casual reading it may seem like an unreasonable expense. At certain times you don't want to use an "in bucket" as an outbucket Compare a couple of dollar bucket with losses from any of a number of common diseases.

That out bucket can also be the one used for cleaning paint brushes, using a soap or ammonia solution on the floor. You are still just buying one bucket for the fish in most cases.

In time one may buy a couple of buckets. Dark black buckets are my out buckets for anything suspect. (I got a price I couldn't pass up, on a couple of industrial grade ones.) The inexpensive light colored or white ones from bakeries or the hardware store sales insure that, however peroccupied one is, clean new water isn't administered in a suspect bucket.

Even with the "nasty" bucket, there is always a freezing night like this evening. And in the summer, they may get the bleach solution from a cleaned out tank, before it is dumped down a toilet or laundry room sink.

Getting back to your observation about healthy looking vs unhealthy looking fishes,I think you are on to something. You've read Houde's book since I have. Is that where it suggested that female guppies will refuse diseased males? They seem to be able to tell.

That might be a que to deworm a tank.

All the best!
u.s.

[ Parent ]



Re: Were you able to siphon that out ASAP? (none / 0) (#17)
by PeterW on Fri Feb 11, 2005 at 09:16:04 AM PST

oops, I forgot to answer the question.  I have a photo, but no microscope.  What is especially disturbing is that she's let one of these cyst type things out before, about a week or so ago.

[ Parent ]


Re: Were you able to siphon that out ASAP? (none / 1) (#16)
by PeterW on Fri Feb 11, 2005 at 09:13:51 AM PST

I have a stack of buckets in two colours from home depot.  White = clean (in) water, Red/orange = dirty (out) or unknown.  I have about 15 "out" buckets that I leave to dry outside after use.  

The only possible transgression is when I catch fry that get siphoned into the 'out' buckets and put them back in the tank.  But by then, the bucket is 99.9999% of the current tank's water and I'd have to be moderately unlucky to transfer something that way.  But it is possible.

BTW: I was right about which of the three tanks had the worms - it was the ones with the fish behaving strangely.  So far there have been no worms on the tank bottoms in the other nearby tanks that I've treated, but plenty in the contaminated ones.  I'm quite amazed that there is such a difference, I'd expected camallanus would spread like lightning, but it seems that I've had some that have had worms for months (reaching maturity) and have other tanks that still appear clean.

I've noticed that even a fairly strong bleach mixture takes a disturbingly long time to kill the wretched things..  A 30%-ish solution of chlorine bleach still had wrigglers after 10-15 minutes.  I have oxygen bleach (peroxide I think) too, but I didn't want to risk mixing the two together - I dont recall my chemistry that well.  Having two buckets with strong chemicals next to each other is inviting trouble.  I dont want to mistakenly mix them and discover a way to generate chlorine gas or the like.

[ Parent ]



It takes about three months for the worms to reach (none / 0) (#18)
by unclescott on Fri Feb 11, 2005 at 12:09:25 PM PST

maturity. So if your fish became infected at the wholesalers (sometimes with their central flow through systems) and you picked up the fish at a shop a couple of weeks later, 2.5 to three months before you discover the damage is not unusual. I think you suggested that large guppies not delivering fry, in addition to your more recent behavioral observations, are important warning signs.

However by the time the adult Ca,ellanus are releasing young, the guppies or whatever is hosting them, could be in pretty bad shape. That is the problem with hidden biological time bombs we may not even know exist.

I've a couple of 2.5 gallon tanks which don't get used as much any more, except as holding tanks for new purchases. So long as they are there anyway, adding a dewormer and then maybe the next week changing out the water 100% and adding a parasite guard for internal stuff is not a bad idea.

My purchases these days are mostly from club auctions. They are not as inclined towards illnesses as stuff which has gone through commercial channels and been exposed to more fish and more stress. Velvet spores and bacteria could still come in through the water supply or be airborn, so it still makes sense to keep the tank as clean as possible.

My one case of Ich in decades came in with some Endler's via a club transaction (Christmas party actually - Ho Ho Ho) and must have been quiescent for 3-4 years before having the opportunity to break out of their cysts to make themselves known.  Got greedy at the ALA convention and placed several fish together in a ten gallon tank and Hexamida took some of them. The two tanks of Goodieds which were set up by themselves were fine.

When, oh when, will "my eyes not be bigger than my stomach?"

All the best!
unc;e

[ Parent ]



AARGH!!! !@#^%!@$# Camallanus! | 18 comments (18 topical, 0 editorial, 0 hidden)
Display: Sort:

Menu

· create account

· F.A.Q. For Newbies!

· Immediate Help For Newbies!

· search


Web www.guppylog.com

· Scoop Info

· Our Tanks

Login
Make a new account
Username:
Password:

SourceForge Logo Powered by Scoop
Subscribe to our news feed
All trademarks and copyrights on this page are owned by their respective companies. Comments are owned by the Poster. The Rest © 2002 and beyond The Management

create account | faq | search